Buick is next

[76HOProposal]

I heard today from a good source that Buick will join Oldsmobile as the next division to cease to exist. It looks like all GM wants to keep around is Chevrolet and Cadillac.

I can understand on one level. But being an American that still cares about this country. I want to fight. (all the good that will do) I remember when that feeling was very common.

I also remember that the world once looked to this country for the best cars built. General Motors was this country's largest business. All the efforts of the people that made that happen and hold for so long. Now for what?

Because of both of those things, this will not be easy to watch happen. :o

[ragz442]

I've heard that also. The dealership I work at had to give up the Buick franchise to the Pontiac dealership across the street. I don't think Pontiac's going anywhere though, but who knows.

[jds1976cutlassS]

According to the sales dept.at the Buick-Pontiac-GMC dealership that I work at,Buick sales are actually better than they were 5 years ago,but not as good as 10 years ago.I've done warrenty work and collision work on all of the new Buicks out there,the engineering is there but they dont have that Buick "feel".I've owned lots of older Buicks from the '70s,'80s,and '90s,and they all "felt"like a Buick should.I'm sure GM feels like they have a narrow customer base that could be served better by one of the "volume" brands.This was the same brain-dead thinking that killed our beloved Oldsmobile in the late '90s.They dont need to "re-invent"the brand,just come out with somthing that we might at least want to go look at!I remember going by the Olds-Buick dealership in the late '80s,they had a GNX in the showroom,3 T-types on the lot and a couple of 442s.YOUNG people went in to look and problebly drove away in a Cutlass Ciera or a 3.0 Century.Hmmm,if it worked then,wouldnt it work now? I thing I hear Alfred P.Sloan rolling in his grave.

[ragz442]

I actually wrote a letter and sent it to GM headquarters in Detroit several years ago [early 90's] suggesting they bring back the "fab 4". You know, roll out a 442, GS, GTO, SS with each having a retro look to the older A body legends. I never got a reply, they probably just laughed and threw it in the trash.

[jds1976cutlassS]

Maybe they did actually read it,they tried with the GTO,even if it did have a generic Pontiac look. I'm beginning to think that GM management doesnt want to bother if they cant sell at least 100,000 units.:confused: I've read that if the new Camaro doesn't sell like mad they'll kill it too.Ford seems to have had good luck with the new Mustang,the Ford store here sets a GT 500 out by the street and they cant keep the regular Mustang cars in stock.Imagine what a new Buick,V-8,rear wheel drive,Saturn yellow w/black GSX stripe,retro look inside and out would do for their sales!:eek:

[Stocker]

I remember hearing a couple years ago that Buick was offered a version of the Pontiac G8 (Invicta, anyone?) but the dealers didn't want a RWD V8. :rolleyes:

So GM wants to dump Buick, everyone ('cept me) thinks FoMoCo is going to give Mercury the axe, Mopar is down to Chrysler and Dodge and half of their lineup is ready to be killed.

[smblkolds]

That would be a shame if they axed Buick. I'm an Olds guy but have owned a couple Buicks (84 Regal, 87 T-Type Century) and liked them. Mercury too. When my father passed away I got his 2002 Grand Marquis and find it to be a solid car and nice driver. All I can say is if you have room, try to save some of these cars from the crusher. Can't wait "till my 3.73 posi rear is done and delivered for my "76 Cutlass S though!

[Firethorne77]

I have to repectfully disagree.. that Buick is not NEXTto meet Oldsmobile's fate.
The following links bellow have loads of future product development links and the plans outlined for Buick in the global market.
What we may all find out is that all the outsourcing that was created over the past 20 years or more, may begin to come back "in-house" and create jobs in the U.S.

Whomever the credible source may be that you mentioned, it would be informational that if it comes from anyone in GM's Dealer network.. that they worry about GM's plan to downsize all the dealers which in turn will require those to be very aware what is in the pipeline for future product development to make certain a specific make will be viable not just here in the U.S. market but worldwide.

Peter DeLorenzo from Autoextremist.com. Has gone into this subject matter for years with a long list of problems and fixes for GM's dealer network.
I wouldnt bet on Buick being dead anytime soon, as a product revitilization is under way there, aka. Cadillac the past 6 years.
=============================================

http://www.autoblog.com/2008/02/10/gm-to-speed-up-dealer-consolidation/

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http://www.autoblog.com/2007/12/30/execs-say-buick-to-get-more-bold-dramatic/

http://www.autoblog.com/2008/01/11/detroit-2008-buick-riviera-concept-debuts-in-us/

Last but not least:

http://www.gminsidenews.com/forums/showthread.php?t=60465

[58thndy]

a product revitilization is under way there, aka. Cadillac the past 6 years

Hmm. The "Cadillac revitalization" of the 80s is what sealed Olds' fate. The Division was making money, just not as many sales as the parent wanted, and a whole lot of that money Olds made for GM went to bring Cadillac back after they had damn near killed it with Cimarrons, HT4100's, V8-6-4's and other unproven technology. Time was stuff would not have got out the door on a Cadillac if it hadn't been tested to work beyond any doubt.

Interesting that Olds sales had gone back to their traditional 400-600 thousand a year, but it was down from the million a year of the mid 70s and the parent couldn't understand why that had happened. Then the parent wouldn't invest in new product and R&D for Oldsmobile, thinking (misguidedly) that sales didn't justify it.

It's simple, idiots. You were no longer making exciting, affordable, quality cars. You were counting beans and making appliances, and cutting corners everywhere you could, while your sales were hemorrhaging. And you couldn't understand why.

There really were some people in GM management back then that needed to be killed. Their crimes? Stupidity and greed.

[sumrof75]

As I recall as Olds was gasping its last, the autoshow was touring with an Olds prototype called the "ohfour" as in 2004. The auto mags gave an attaboy for going out with class, as a Olds fan I saw it as a smokescreen for the falling axe. Anyone forget that the Olds motors that were doing so well in Indy car racing were rebadged as Chevrolet after that year? How much tech did they put into that engine? Parent company or not that engine was a decendant of the Doc.

[76HOProposal]

There really were some people in GM management back then that needed to be killed. Their crimes? Stupidity and greed.

The part that I have the toughest time with is. How do they live with themselves afterwords? It seems like we have an overabundance of soulless people in all corporations. I guess the thought is that their decisions will never come full circle back at them or impact their lives in any way shape or form. Much like politicians, judges and lawyers. The greed for a short term gain thereby destroying the quality of life for large amount of others in the future.

Sorry, but I'll never understand that for as long as I live.

The same guy that broke the news to me about Olds (which I found impossible to believe) before anyone else announced. Told me this about Buick. I guess we'll wait and see.

[442oldslawyer]

I have owned several 70- 72 GS cars and one GSX 4speed . I love the cars. However in today's market with Cadillac , Chebbie and Poncho-- there really is no need to keep Buicks. There lineup could and is duplicated in each of the other brands and is selling. It is just a matter of time.

[damaged442]

Still to this day, I have no idea why they kept Saturn?!?:confused: :mad:

[77 Cutlass Supreme]

I don't think Buick is going to die anytime soon. GM does have too many dealers and they have to get rid of stand alone dealers that only sell Buick's. Consolidating Buick, Pontiac and GMC under one roof is a good idea. The future of the auto industry will be in growing markets like China and over there the Buick brand is doing very good, people actually aspire to owning a Buick. I think a brand that is not global like Pontiac would be axed before Buick.

[76HOProposal]

Gentlemen,

It all depends on your sales numbers of your cars. I don't care how "global" something is. lol What a word. Used by everyone these days as an........ excuse and or punch line of those in short sighted management. Hello! If it is a good product it will go global. If they don't sell, with the vast amount of red ink in the automotive industry today, they are gone. Enough models in one mark?.......... Goodbye mark.

It really seems more and more like the curtain has fallen and the spotlight now shows GM's obviously poor management at every turn. They can't hide now. And the old tactics used for job preservation of the past aren't going to work. ( a la, the old corporate game of who's butt do I kiss?)

You are paid for performance in today's cut throat world.

Sure they have had some success here and there. But even an occasional home run won't guarantee you any future anymore. Now a home run is needed several times a year.

After some thought. I think making the GM corporation smaller IS the best option. They currently have way to much human baggage at the top that are in SO FAR over their heads.

It is a common mistake made today is to cut your work force first in lowering red ink. What really needs to happen is to cut, slash and fire at the middle and upper first. Where design, marketing and production planning is your armor in responding to variable changes. Cut your work force the way they do, and you inhibit your ability to bounce back to productivity.

Oh, watch the dynamic that is going on at Toyota. To many niche car models. They are caught with their pants down and undercutting the Americans won't help with this problem. :D They too got fat and happy.

IT'S A SICK WORLD..........YOU'VE GOT TO LOVE IT!

[RocketMan]

From what I have read, the Buick brand is huge in China, and Buick sales there are quite good. Perhaps GM will stop domestic sales of Buicks.

Personally, I would have thought that Pontiac would be next. As for Chevy, how many Camaros do you think they can sell for $35K - $40K ? Price alone will kill this one.

[77 Cutlass Supreme]

From what I have read, the Buick brand is huge in China, and Buick sales there are quite good. Perhaps GM will stop domestic sales of Buicks.

Personally, I would have thought that Pontiac would be next. As for Chevy, how many Camaros do you think they can sell for $35K - $40K ? Price alone will kill this one.

Buick is doing very good in China and once they have P-B-GMC aligned under one roof here Buick can be successful again with fewer models. The Enclave has gotten great reviews and the new Lacrosse that's coming in a year that is based on the 08 Malibu should help.

[77 Cutlass Supreme]

Gentlemen,

It all depends on your sales numbers of your cars. I don't care how "global" something is. lol What a word. Used by everyone these days as an........ excuse and or punch line of those in short sighted management. Hello! If it is a good product it will go global. If they don't sell, with the vast amount of red ink in the automotive industry today, they are gone. Enough models in one mark?.......... Goodbye mark.

It really seems more and more like the curtain has fallen and the spotlight now shows GM's obviously poor management at every turn. They can't hide now. And the old tactics used for job preservation of the past aren't going to work. ( a la, the old corporate game of who's butt do I kiss?)

You are paid for performance in today's cut throat world.

Sure they have had some success here and there. But even an occasional home run won't guarantee you any future anymore. Now a home run is needed several times a year.

After some thought. I think making the GM corporation smaller IS the best option. They currently have way to much human baggage at the top that is in SO FAR over their heads.

It is a common mistake made today is to cut your work force first in lowering red ink. What really needs to happen is to cut, slash and fire at the middle and upper first. Where design, marketing and production planning is your armor in responding to variable changes. Cut your work force the way they do, and you inhibit your ability to bounce back to productivity.

Oh, watch the dynamic that is going on at Toyota. To many niche car models. They are caught with their pants down and undercutting the Americans won't help with this problem. :D They too got fat and happy.

IT'S A SICK WORLD..........YOU'VE GOT TO LOVE IT!

The curtain fell on GM's poor management 20 years ago and only now are they starting to get there act together. I get sick of hearing the term "Global" too sometimes but a lot of it makes sense. If Buick can be so successful in China then I think it can be here again with the right products. If they had 4-5 excellent products they could survive, though not sell as many as they did in the good old days but maybe enough to be profitable.

Or GM could be trying to consolidate Buick with P-GMC dealers and then kill off Buick without having to kill off all the dealerships and run into all the legal problems like they had when they axed Olds, who knows.

[Hurstolds1973]

I worked for Arnold Buick in Sewell NJ after I graduated High School. Very very sad to think another car company will be lost. Joe

[76HOProposal]

Personally, I would have thought that Pontiac would be next. As for Chevy, how many Camaros do you think they can sell for $35K - $40K ? Price alone will kill this one.

The word is right on the appeal of Buick in China. I would think they will place a plant close to that market over there. After yet another failure of another model GTO. Maybe they have figured out you can't ship across a large body of water and make much money. All the divisions aren't doing all that well in this economy.

If the new Camaro bombs and you will no doubt see some crazy events unfold. (And they are privately worried about it's reception. Because of this fact they have been showing it at all kinds of ride and drive events to try and help it's introduction. It needs to suceed for things to stay on an even level at GM.)
I agree the price is high for what you are getting. Wish it looked like a Chevrolet with their traditional lines. A high end body shop close to me has a customer that is going to re-body one of the new Camaros as soon as he gets it. I offered to help them on weekends for free. :D Ed Welburn was the designer of the new Camaro's exterior. It's exterior looks way to much like the CTS/Ford Mustang for my tastes. I must also say the guy that designed the interior from what I've seen did a nice job!