455 vs 350 pros cons

[chrisslicks]

Hey all,

I joined the site a couple of months ago and just started posting. I've got a 1975 442 w/350. Right now its stock and I'm not really satisfied with the power. I bought some flowtech headers, edelbrock intake and plan to get some flowmasters. That's about all I want to do w/o doing an engine breakdown. The work was supposed to begin today but I halted the process because I got a line on a 455 out of a 1970 delta 88. It has 65,000 miles on it from what I've been told. For sh&ts and giggles let's say the 455 is decent. What are some of the pros and cons of doing a swap like this? I figure I was going to do an engine breakdown next year any way, so do get my money back for the the parts and run a stock 455 till next year? Help me out guys! BTW the price for the 455 is $450 but I think I can get it for 3.

cslicks

[1977 Cutly]

no replacement for displacement. I've dealt with many different motors over the years, 302s 350s a bunch of 400 and 403s, even a 425 in a 1966 Toro. I've found that bigger is always better, especially when it comes to low end torque, which is what I like on the street.

My lil bro has a bad ass built 350 Rocket, he spent a small fortune on. I've always thought it could be so much more if if was a 455.

[W451973]

Snatch up that 455. Leave your 350 alone so you can drive and enjoy the car while you build the 455.

[THE MALIGOON]

two words for BBO builds................MORE MONEY you mention BBO at a parts counter and they start to see dollar signs

[zates]

This is an excellent site with a tremendous amount of information, including a section on the pro's and con's of 350/455 swaps.

http://www.442.com/oldsfaq/oldsfaq.htm#Table%20of%20Contents

[W451973]

When it comes to Olds, there really is no difference in pricing from a small block to a big block. And what few things that are, are not that much more. You also have to know where to shop. For instance, we have a local speed shop that got my buddy some bearings for a 455 cheaper then summit or jegs could get them. Shop around.

[THE MALIGOON]

we need a shop like that around here does he wanna branch out ??? LOL

[chrisslicks]

Snatch up that 455. Leave your 350 alone so you can drive and enjoy the car while you build the 455.
That's a great idea. I maybe able to sell it for a few bucks to off-set some of the rebuild costs. Thanks

[chrisslicks]

A buddy, or so called buddy, of mine has two 11 sec. novas. He was trying to sell me his chevy engine, but I don't want it (I'm an Olds man Dag-nabbit!!). So when I was asking about the swap he was giving this load about the 455 was crap and had no power and I would be better off with what I have. I think I'm ready to end our friendship. What can I tell this dude to set him straight?

[THE MALIGOON]

prove it when it is built at the track that will shut him up forever

[MrRocket]

You'll spend money getting the 350 to where the 455 is already. The 455 might possibly be enough stock for what you want (I don't know what you want). Should be over 300 horsies in stock form. If you do anything to the big block you should see nice results with a lesser investment. However, if you go big block you might have to go bigger tranny too, depending on what you do. 455 will cost more at the pump not only because it uses more gas but it requires a higher octane gas. You'll be buying 94 octane and adding octane booster and lead additive ( unless you change compression and valve seats during build). Olds 350's are awesome motors and are problably the best 350 there is, some would say the best small block. Alot of racers prefer the 350 and have very fast cars. They have more potiential than chevy 350's in they can be bored out more and 425 cranks will fit in them making a "big small block". My suggestion is build one and save the other. Drive the 350 till you get the 455 ready and then put the 350 in a corner and save it. Both are good options. The only reason I don't have a 350 is that my car didn't have any motor when I got it and a 425 was the first one available to me.

[THE MALIGOON]

Paul tell me more about that 425 crank conversion with the 350 ?? did I read that right ?? you can PM me or link it to where I can read about that

[chrisslicks]

Great posts guys. I read on a link that someone sent that if you add headers to a 455 in cutlass you will have to cut into the wheel wells and affect the turn radius. If this was going to be a strictly strip then i would be less concerned. But seeing on how I am going to drive this bad on the street I am a little nervous. How true is this?

[zodiacblue442]

My .02...
I love Olds 350's and they make great performance engines. They are lighter than a big block and have lots of torque and hp potential. You can turn a race prepped 350 up to 6,000 rpm for short durations. I've seen some scary fast Oldsmobiles with 350's in them. The big block 455's are absolute torque monsters. They generate lots of hp too but are known for torque because of the big bore and long stroke. I would not recommend turning a 455 over 5,000 rpm, or 5,600 rpm if its race prepped. Money will be about the same whether you build a 350 or 455. So if you have the itch for a 455, get one! The 425 big block is a very good engine too. Its shorter stroke allows for turning a few more rpm. I've been told you can get just as much hp out of a 425 than a 455. I've always had 73 and later Oldsmobiles so I've never done much with 425's.

My opinion regarding headers... I hate 'em. :mad: My one experience with headers was they were a total pain to install and leaked like a sieve. Unless you're building an all out race engine, I'd go with a set of divided port exhaust manifolds. Thornton Reproductions make a beautiful set for both big block and small block engines.

The 455 in my race car is bored .030 so it's now a 461. It's race prepped and has been a bullet proof engine for several years. The car turns low 13's and about 103 mph at the track which is close to 6,000 feet above sea level. My brother and I run the car HARD!!! I love doing those smokey burnouts which reminds me I need to buy new race tires for next season... :rolleyes: :)

[zodiacblue442]

Paul tell me more about that 425 crank conversion with the 350 ?? did I read that right ?? you can PM me or link it to where I can read about that

I second it. More info pleeeeezzzzeeeee! I just tore apart a 425 and supposedly sold a bunch of stuff from that engine, including the crank. I'll know by this weekend if it's sold. The guy and I are supposed to meet at the race track. I hope I don't load up all the parts for nothing...

[1977 Cutly]

Snatch up that 455. Leave your 350 alone so you can drive and enjoy the car while you build the 455.


If your budget allows, this advice is ideal. If your budget doesn't allow, learn how to cut your budget.

[MrRocket]

Well, I read it in a Car Craft article many years ago(might be able to look up an archived article on their website). What they did was discuss how you could bore a 350 and put in a 425 rotating assembly(crank, rods, pistons). They ended up with telling what could be done to a 350 saying if you sonic checked a bore you could go as far as 440 cubic inches. The article is called "The Other 350's" and Olds had the best potiential. They didn't do the build mentioned but they did suggest it was possible. I'll see if I can find an article link or something.

[chrisslicks]

I'm sold!! I talked to my mechanic this morning and we're going to leave the 350 as is and snatch up the 455. He's going to allow me to "pay as you go" for the rebuild. This way I can still ride and stretch out payments for a monster 455. I'll keep you guys posted with updates and, of course, other questions

[THE MALIGOON]

Well, I read it in a Car Craft article many years ago.
yeee haawwwww found it

I found this article but not the dyno test yet:


The Other 350s: Buick. MARLAN DAVIS. Car Craft 48.2 (Feb 2000): p42. (904 words)



Full Text: COPYRIGHT 2000 Petersen Publishing Company
At only 450 pounds, the Buick is the lightest of GM's all-iron 350s. The compact, 3.80-inch-bore engine reaches its 349.3ci actual displacement with a long (for a 350) 3.85-inch stroke. Such a bore/stroke ratio makes for good low-end torque but limits breathing potential.

The best of the Buick 350s were the '69-'70 four-barrel engines. Rated at 10.0:1, they actually come in about 9.5-9.8:1 with the typical FelPro head gaskets and 59cc small-block Buick heads--just about dead-on for use with today's premium unleaded pump gas. Later engines lowered compression entirely through a piston change. Milling the heads 0.040 inch raises the late engine's 8.5:1 compression ratio about one full point to 9.5:1 (also take 0.040 inch off the symmetrical heads' intake face so the intake still bolts up).


All 350 production heads have about the same performance potential. There is enough casting material to easily install unleaded-fuel-compatible hardened exhaust seat inserts. The '75-'80 heads used 1.55-inch exhaust valves, while the '68-'74 heads had smaller, 1.50-inch valves; all used 1.875-inch intakes. Stock valves have heavy 3/8-inch-diameter stems and weird 11-degree Liberty-lock retainers. For performance use, add bronze guides, then install stainless steel 1.92-inch intake and 1 .55-inch exhaust valves with readily available Chevy/Ford-style 1 1/32-inch stems that accept normal 7- or 10-degree retainers and locks.


Feed the heads with TA Performance's Stage 1 dual-plane or Poston Enterprise's S-Divider intake manifold. Both come dual-machined to accept either Holley or Quadrajet four-barrel carburetors. Poston offers fully blueprinted 800-cfm Q-Jets. In the Holley line, the 750-cfm double-pumper works best. If retaining a mechanical fuel pump, Poston's 350 Stage 1 design flows 120 gallons/hour at 8 psi.
Ignite the mixture with GM's affordable and reliable HEI distributor. Rework the advance curve so it's all in by 2,600 rpm. Average street cars can handle 32-34 degrees, but if you can find good fuel, the Buick likes up to 40 degrees total, with 12-14 degrees at idle (lock-out the vacuum advance). Headers should have 1%- or 1 3/4-inch primaries into 3-inch collectors. Poston and TA have complete mandrel-bent 2 1/2-inch exhaust systems for the 350-powered '64-'72 GS and Skylark.


Using its manifold, cam, headers, and 9.5:1 compression, TA Performance claims 350 hp. But if you intend to consistently lean on the engine, the Buick needs help in the oiling department. At a minimum, increase oil-pump pressure and efficiency by installing a booster-plate kit between the oil filter housing and front cover assembly. However, Poston feels a complete new high-volume/high-pressure pump is needed to keep the Buick alive. If rebuilding the engine from scratch, additional oil system-enhancing parts and mods are available from Buick niche specialists.


Even though 0.060-inch oversize pistons are available, most Buick sources recommend going no more than 0.040 over. The '73-and-later Buick 350 capscrew rods stronger than earlier nut-and-bolt rods. Besides, TA has ARP bolts for the late rods, while there's no replacement bolt for the early design at all. Finally, replace the leak-prone rope rear-main seal with an aftermarket neoprene seal; a one-piece front-main seal is also available to replace the stock two-piece seal.


Buick 350 Hydraulic Cam Recommendations
Buick niche specialists offer a wide variety of performance
cams and complimentary valvetrain components. Their
recommendations for a hot street bolt-on buildup are listed here.
Duration
Source Cam Part No. Claimed Adver- 0.050- Valve
Power tised inch Lift ***
Range (Int./ (Int./ 1.55:1
(Rpm) Exh.) Exh.) Rockers
(Int./
Exh.)
Kenne-Bell Mark 2H 1,500-5,500 270[degrees]/ 214[degrees]/ 0.463"/
(Kit KB350SH) 284[degrees] 228[degrees] 0.479"
Poston GS350-112 3,000-6,000 288[degrees]/ 232[degrees]/ 0.494"/
300[degrees] 240[degrees] 0.502"
TA Performance TA310 2,000-6,000 284[degrees]/ 232[degrees]/ 0.499"/
284[degrees] 232[degrees] 0.499"
Source Lobe Lobe Valve- Retainer
Cen- Dis- spring Part No.
terline place- Part No.
(Int./ ment
Exh.) Angle
Kenne-Bell 108[degrees]/ 113[degrees] KB11003 KB11004
118[degrees]
Poston 108[degrees]/ 113[degrees] PE107 PE108
116[degrees]
TA Performance 106[degrees]/ 110[degrees] TA 1130 TA 1450
114[degrees]

The stock nonadjustable Buick valvetrain can't cope with high-lift cams. Adjustable pushrods are the cheap way out, but for maximum durability move up to needle-bearing rocker kits like Kenne-Bell's 1.6:1 setup (stockers are 1.55:1).

Low-cost oil pressure booster plates (A) are an easy fix for the Buick's chronic low-oil-pressure woes. Combine the plate with a high-pressure spring and an adjustable pressure regulator screw (B).
Equipped with the right stuff, Buick's 350 makes a fine dual-purpose street/strip package. This one will find a home in Dave Benisek's '73 Apollo.


A 180-degree highrise design, TA Performance's Stage 1 dual-plane maintains great low-and midrange torque yet is worth 25-35 hp on top. It clears stock hoods with stock air cleaners.
The head porters at BPE say Buick heads respond to moderate bowl-porting: Streamline the guides and rework the valve-throat area. With a relatively tall intake port, the heads flow well considering their small valve area.


With its cast-in plenum divider, Poston's S-Divider manifold combines the dualplane's low-end power with a single-plane's top-end performance but still provides plenty of hood clearance. Poston claims 30-35 hp over a stock intake.

Both upper and lower cam sprockets are keyed on the Buick. Offset keys aren't available, so accurately dialing in the cam requires a multi-keyway timing set. This TA Performance billet steel double-roller unit has nine key-ways that permit advancing or retarding the timing in 2-degree increments.
A good ram air system is hard to beat. Poston offers this Ram Air kit for the '64-'72 GS, GSX, and Skylark that's easily adaptable to other GM A-bodies. Poston claims 30 hp over the factory Ram Air setup.

Source CitationAVIS, MARLAN. "The Other 350s: Buick." Car Craft 48.2 (Feb 2000): 42. General OneFile. Gale. Apollo Library. 8 Jan. 2009
<http://find.galegroup.com/itx/start.do?prodId=ITOF>.
Gale Document Number:A59599972

[Allen442]

This might help, I found this on 442.com I remembered reading it at one time.

Here's the link: http://www.442.com/oldsfaq/ofedsl.htm#EDSL DieselEngineDetail

The 350 diesel block with a 425 crank and the stock bore size block (4.057") will yield a bulletproof 411 CID gasoline small block. The 350 diesel block can be safely overbored .125" without sonic testing, to make a 437 CID small block. The 350 diesel block can be bored out to 4.25" when sonic tested. With a shaved down 425 crank and a 3.975 stroke, that works out to 451 cubic inches.

I always liked this idea here:

http://www.442.com/oldsfaq/ofe403.htm#E403 403CIDEngineDetail

403 With a 425 Crank
If I win the lottery (which I don't play), I'd tool up for some 403 castings with a diesel bottom-end to take the 425's crank. I'm still scheming about a 425 crank with cut-down journals being dropped into a 403 block; I _want_ a 500+ci SMALL BLOCK! Of course, I'd have to put 260 stickers on it... :)

[THE MALIGOON]

ACTUAL ARTICLE FOR OLDS


http://www.mondellotwister.com/images/props.gif
http://www.mondellotwister.com/Articles/TheOther350s1.jpg
http://www.mondellotwister.com/Articles/TheOther350s2.jpg

[THE MALIGOON]

Mods or site owner please sticky at least this and the stuff with sway bar info

[W451973]

Anthony, thanks for posting this.

Just to clarify. small blocks should be left to light cars. Heavy cars need the torqe of a big block.

[Macrover]

...Snatch up that 455. Leave your 350 alone so you can drive and enjoy the car while you build the 455.

...build one and save the other. Drive the 350 till you get the 455 ready and then put the 350 in a corner and save it. Both are good options.

I've been pondering on this idea as well. My Father has a 455 he pulled from my Grandfathers vista cruiser back in the early 80's.

Not sure of it's condition now but it was a good running engine back then.

Funny, my Dad and I were just discussing the 455 last evening. We're going to check it out soon and see what we're up against.

Based on some of the advice posted and the article, I leaning toward snatching up the 455, rebuilding it (if possible), and stowing the 350 when the 455 is ready for installation...Otherwise, I'm going to drive my car as is.

[damaged442]

. Heavy cars need the torque of a big block.

...and THAT'S another reason DONUTRUN kicks ass!!

[1977 Cutly]

Of course, I'd have to put 260 stickers on it... :)

The first thing I did after my 455 install was exactly that! Great minds think alike. I couldn't keep them on for long, though. It made me feel like apologizing to my car every morning.....

[Macrover]

Ha! I'm sure your forgot about stickers as you were pressing the throttle. :D

[chrisslicks]

I've been pondering on this idea as well. My Father has a 455 he pulled from my Grandfathers vista cruiser back in the early 80's.

Not sure of it's condition now but it was a good running engine back then.

Funny, my Dad and I were just discussing the 455 last evening. We're going to check it out soon and see what we're up against.

Based on some of the advice posted and the article, I leaning toward snatching up the 455, rebuilding it (if possible), and stowing the 350 when the 455 is ready for installation...Otherwise, I'm going to drive my car as is.

If I had room to store the 350 i would, but I have no room plus I have to sell it to help pay for the rebuild. Let me throw this question out, should I keep the 350 trans or go with the 400? I've got stock gears and won't be able to switch for another two years according to my master plan (heh heh heh evil laugh). My application is quite simple..I just wanna be just like Ricky Bobby and go fast. Let me know what you think.

[75wannabe]

You'll spend money getting the 350 to where the 455 is already. The 455 might possibly be enough stock for what you want (I don't know what you want). Should be over 300 horsies in stock form. -snip-

One thing people are not mentioning here is the stock differences in the years of 455's.. I don't know what a '70 455 is rated at, but the '75 is rated at only around 190HP.. just 15 or 20 more than the stock 350cid... not a big difference there.

Donovan

[THE MALIGOON]

One thing people are not mentioning here is the stock differences in the years of 455's.. I don't know what a '70 455 is rated at, but the '75 is rated at only around 190HP.. just 15 or 20 more than the stock 350cid... not a big difference there.

Donovan

my buddys 68 455 I believe was rated 375 HP........ at least that's what the reference books I have list it at.

[75wannabe]

my buddys 68 455 I believe was rated 375 HP........ at least that's what the reference books I have list it at.

Right, which is my point... because of an oil crisis back in 73 or so, Olds wanted to be a more fuel conscious company.. so ponies went down significantly soon after.

So, the OP's idea of building up an older 455 may not be a bad idea performance-wise.

The other option, to keep things more original, would be to find a '75 455 and figure out ways to increase the HP rating. I don't know much about that, but would be interested... I assume it's not much different than the article on increasing the HP rating of 350's.

Donovan

[W451973]

If I had room to store the 350 i would, but I have no room plus I have to sell it to help pay for the rebuild. Let me throw this question out, should I keep the 350 trans or go with the 400? I've got stock gears and won't be able to switch for another two years according to my master plan (heh heh heh evil laugh). My application is quite simple..I just wanna be just like Ricky Bobby and go fast. Let me know what you think.

If you sell the 350 then the car will be down until you are able to get the 455 done and ready to go in. Are you willing to take that chance ? Ultimately you will need to change over to a short tail 400 trans but at least you could drive the car for now with the t-350. You need to set down and figure put what your plan is for the car. Like how much horsepower you want ? Strip or street car ? Or mostly street ? Are you planning on driving it on the highway ? If so you have to decide what gear ratio you want. After you figure out your plans, THEN, factor in your budget and you'll have an idea of what to do.

One big mistake most guys make is they decide to build a big motor first or tear apart the whole car at one time and then can't afford to drive it or finish it.

Personally, after you get your game plan together, I would do the rear end first. That will wake that 350 up some. And you can still enjoy the car while you build the 455.

[smblkolds]

Thats exactly what I did. Put a re-built 10 bolt in the back first. 3:73 posi. Was going to build the car "Backwards" from the rear so I wouldn't be blowing rears and the stock th350. Money got tight so I'm still waiting on the 455 and th400 but the car has more snap off the line now anyway with the stock anemic 180hp 350. Its a 1976 Cutlass S by the way.

[chrisslicks]

If you sell the 350 then the car will be down until you are able to get the 455 done and ready to go in. Are you willing to take that chance ? Ultimately you will need to change over to a short tail 400 trans but at least you could drive the car for now with the t-350. You need to set down and figure put what your plan is for the car. Like how much horsepower you want ? Strip or street car ? Or mostly street ? Are you planning on driving it on the highway ? If so you have to decide what gear ratio you want. After you figure out your plans, THEN, factor in your budget and you'll have an idea of what to do.

One big mistake most guys make is they decide to build a big motor first or tear apart the whole car at one time and then can't afford to drive it or finish it.

Personally, after you get your game plan together, I would do the rear end first. That will wake that 350 up some. And you can still enjoy the car while you build the 455.

Well...that's a lot to think about. My car has been down for 6 yrs so sitting for a few more months won't bother me much, old man winter is just around the corner and you know what these mid-west are like so it'll be sittin anyway. This is mostly street (cruise nights, car shows eventually, and showin off at the light lol). At some point I would like to drive it to special Oldsmobile events so I would put on the highway if I was assured by my mechanic that I could make it (long walk from nationals to Chicago). But other than that, highway runs would be 50miles or less. Lets say I want to build the 455 to stock hp, pre-73, 1) could I do that with a engine rebuild kit, proper application of course, and 2) with that being done and adding performance carb, intake manifold, and headers: what type of horsepower am I looking at? I asked about the trans because it may come with the motor and have been told that it may not make much difference. BTW did you sell that w-34?

[chrisslicks]

One thing people are not mentioning here is the stock differences in the years of 455's.. I don't know what a '70 455 is rated at, but the '75 is rated at only around 190HP.. just 15 or 20 more than the stock 350cid... not a big difference there.

Donovan

I agree that's why I want to go pre-73.

[Macrover]

...Personally, after you get your game plan together, I would do the rear end first. That will wake that 350 up some. And you can still enjoy the car while you build the 455.

Spot on.

Even though I'm anxious to get that 455 checked out and rebuilt, I believe I'm going to go at that project "a$$ backwards" ,if you catch my drift, and tweak the rear end for future plans and enjoy my car as is for now.

Excellent points on the year/HP differences. With this HP discussion and the unknown of the 455 my Father has, it could be anybodies guess until a fact sheet/dyno proves reality.

The casting number is 396021 F with Ga head and I believe it's a late 60's very early 70's engine but not certain.

[chrisslicks]

Spot on.

Even though I'm anxious to get that 455 checked out and rebuilt, I believe I'm going to go at that project "a$$ backwards" ,if you catch my drift, and tweak the rear end for future plans and enjoy my car as is for now.

Excellent points on the year/HP differences. With this HP discussion and the unknown of the 455 my Father has, it could be anybodies guess until a fact sheet/dyno proves reality.

The casting number is 396021 F with Ga head and I believe it's a late 60's very early 70's engine but not certain.

I catch your drift,
That's why I was asking about using a rebuild kit to get a pre- 73 to stock. I have heard that they,68-71, came stock with at least 300 hp. I have also heard that there are different codes to these 455s and they each may yield different hp. I guess my thinking is even if I had the least powerful 455 from the aforementioned era, got it to stock plus added a few performance parts shouldn't I be able to do some damage? Not that I'm trying to race, but just incase someone wants to test this or any other 73-77 olds I want them to think twice the next time. Am I right on this or is this just a Ricky Bobby go fast pipe dream?

[W451973]

Well...that's a lot to think about. My car has been down for 6 yrs so sitting for a few more months won't bother me much, old man winter is just around the corner and you know what these mid-west are like so it'll be sittin anyway. This is mostly street (cruise nights, car shows eventually, and showin off at the light lol). At some point I would like to drive it to special Oldsmobile events so I would put on the highway if I was assured by my mechanic that I could make it (long walk from nationals to Chicago). But other than that, highway runs would be 50miles or less. Lets say I want to build the 455 to stock hp, pre-73, 1) could I do that with a engine rebuild kit, proper application of course, and 2) with that being done and adding performance carb, intake manifold, and headers: what type of horsepower am I looking at? I asked about the trans because it may come with the motor and have been told that it may not make much difference. BTW did you sell that w-34?

Well then a little while longer will be no big deal.

The W-34 is sold and now setting in a 79 Trans Am.

Rebuilding to get 300-350 hp is not that hard.

[W451973]

The casting number is 396021 F with Ga head and I believe it's a late 60's very early 70's engine but not certain.

Ga heads are 1972 so I would say you have a 72 motor. Thats a good motor to rebuild. It really does'nt matter what year it is unless you're making an all out race motor. And don't be scared to use the J heads if thats all you have.

You guys need to quite focusing on h/p numbers. Unless you get lucky enough to find a 68-70 hi-compression motor that runs and you can drop it in, you're going to rebuild it with new pistons, etc, you don't need to worry about the stock numbers.

[THE MALIGOON]

Ga heads are 1972 so I would say you have a 72 motor. Thats a good motor to rebuild. It really does'nt matter what year it is unless you're making an all out race motor. And don't be scared to use the J heads if thats all you have.

You guys need to quite focusing on h/p numbers. Unless you get lucky enough to find a 68-70 hi-compression motor that runs and you can drop it in, you're going to rebuild it with new pistons, etc, you don't need to worry about the stock numbers.


YEA and if your lucky enough to actually find that block you will pay more for it than just building up one to begin with

[W451973]

YEA and if your lucky enough to actually find that block you will pay more for it than just building up one to begin with

HUH ? I sold that W-34 motor for $700. It was a running motor. Other then cleaning it up and changing a few minor things, it was a drop in. Stock rated at 400 hp.

Try to rebuild one for that kind of money.

[THE MALIGOON]

well they got a deal on the motor then esp if it was a plug and play one

[manoxide83]

im backing the 455 olds all the way bro this things when built right are screamers and i love this olds bbo best and most powerful car i have ever owned putting close to 600 hp with the build and gets twisted and sideways easy as hell maligoon can valch for that lol and i wasnt even hitting it hard do your self a favor and get that 455 you wont be unhappy

[THE MALIGOON]

I will atest to the BB power of Manoxide's ride but I still say small olds can do the same thing we will see I guess and Chris get that dam thing Dyno'ed at kurgans will ya

[manoxide83]

i will as soon as i get it tuned and ajusted perfect then will see and maybe try a bigger carb to see where the most hp and tq is

[W451973]

Like I said before. Small blocks are best left for lighter cars and big blocks for hevier cars.

[75wannabe]

Like I said before. Small blocks are best left for lighter cars and big blocks for hevier cars.

Depends on what you want IMO.

The 350 rocket was a good motor for the cutlass S 442 in 75. Though the body size wasn't small, it wasn't exactly a galaxy 500 sized car either. When I had one, I made some minor mods (headers/shift kit etc..) which let me over-take the other alike cars (Z28's, mustangs etc..), but that was not really what it was about for me... well, except for the time I ran Airplane fuel in it. :-/

... spark plug change later...

The rocket was just a solid engine that felt as comfortable at 120mph as it did at 35mph.

now, if muscle is your main concern, then yea, I agree with W451973.

Donovan

[zodiacblue442]

Ga heads are 1972 so I would say you have a 72 motor. Thats a good motor to rebuild. It really does'nt matter what year it is unless you're making an all out race motor. And don't be scared to use the J heads if thats all you have.

You guys need to quite focusing on h/p numbers. Unless you get lucky enough to find a 68-70 hi-compression motor that runs and you can drop it in, you're going to rebuild it with new pistons, etc, you don't need to worry about the stock numbers.

Exactly right. And don't forget by 72 all of the hp ratings were changed from gross to net. The change was because the insurance companies were freaking out over the higher and higher hp numbers and drastically raising insurance rates. Gross hp was measured at the flywheel and Net hp was measured at the rear wheels. So even a mid 70's 455 with emissions equipment and crappy J heads measuring a little over 200 net hp would have a much higher gross hp number.

[zodiacblue442]

HUH ? I sold that W-34 motor for $700. It was a running motor. Other then cleaning it up and changing a few minor things, it was a drop in. Stock rated at 400 hp.

Try to rebuild one for that kind of money.

Yep, that was a screamin' deal for that W-34 engine. Can't touch a rebuild for anywhere close to that. A full rebuild with machine work, pistons, cam, rebuild kit, etc. will be $2,000 or more depending if you build it stock or high performance.

[manoxide83]

lot more if you build big power my build was 3200 bucks but it screams

[chrisslicks]

Depends on what you want IMO.

The 350 rocket was a good motor for the cutlass S 442 in 75. Though the body size wasn't small, it wasn't exactly a galaxy 500 sized car either. When I had one, I made some minor mods (headers/shift kit etc..) which let me over-take the other alike cars (Z28's, mustangs etc..), but that was not really what it was about for me... well, except for the time I ran Airplane fuel in it. :-/

... spark plug change later...

The rocket was just a solid engine that felt as comfortable at 120mph as it did at 35mph.

now, if muscle is your main concern, then yea, I agree with W451973.

Donovan
In the grand scheme of things, no I don't really need a 455. But for the same reason some of us pop a viagra every now and again just for the reassurance. There have been really good and thoughtful input on this topic and I like everyone else certainly appreciate the varying opinions. I guess for me the mere thought of having a 455 ci cast iron American Muscle engine that pumps out 300+ horsepower gives me a woodie (no viagra needed). This may sound silly, but I've believed in the saying "It is better to have and not need than to need and not have"

[chrisslicks]

If you sell the 350 then the car will be down until you are able to get the 455 done and ready to go in. Are you willing to take that chance ? Ultimately you will need to change over to a short tail 400 trans but at least you could drive the car for now with the t-350. You need to set down and figure put what your plan is for the car. Like how much horsepower you want ? Strip or street car ? Or mostly street ? Are you planning on driving it on the highway ? If so you have to decide what gear ratio you want. After you figure out your plans, THEN, factor in your budget and you'll have an idea of what to do.

One big mistake most guys make is they decide to build a big motor first or tear apart the whole car at one time and then can't afford to drive it or finish it.

Personally, after you get your game plan together, I would do the rear end first. That will wake that 350 up some. And you can still enjoy the car while you build the 455.
My old mechanic told me that the t350 wouldn't need to be changed and it could handle a 455. I figure if I'm getting a t400 with the motor I might as well use it. Are there any performance differences or does it boil down to how I plan to use the car. As i have said before, I just wanna cruise the streets, spin some tires (just found out that just cuz my Eagle STs look good they may not be safe) but above all go fast.

[chrisslicks]

Cha-Cha sittin on Eagle STs (Thanks for the advice Dave!) Any suggestions on replacement tires?



This is the only one I could upload because I already have the rest under Introducing ChaCha in the introduction forum

[THE MALIGOON]

well if your going to replace them my brother in law swears by BFG's (BF Goodrich) great street ability and when taken to the track provide great traction for a street / strip driven car and when you do that I would interested in the old ones for roller wheels I have here I am only about an hour and half from you in Byron Illinois

[chrisslicks]

cool beans

[W451973]

My old mechanic told me that the t350 wouldn't need to be changed and it could handle a 455. I figure if I'm getting a t400 with the motor I might as well use it. Are there any performance differences or does it boil down to how I plan to use the car. As i have said before, I just wanna cruise the streets, spin some tires (just found out that just cuz my Eagle STs look good they may not be safe) but above all go fast.

Your T-350 will handle a stock, relatively low hp 455 as long as you don't beat on it too much. You can build a t-350 to handle alot of hp but that costs some serious $$$$$. On the plus side, a t-350 is lighter, has a lower first gear and uses less hp to turn then a t-400. ;)

[manoxide83]

the th350 will hold up as long as you dont go radical im on my third th350 because the torque of the 455 keeps twisting front input shaft so i had a th400 built keep in mind the th350 i have been running is stock the 2nd one was built but these 455s are torque monsters so i was advised by foltz transmissions to install the th400 because no matter how built a th350 he said i would twist it with the torque

[442MUCH]

Cha-Cha sittin on Eagle STs (Thanks for the advice Dave!) Any suggestions on replacement tires?

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v417/vttedrm/DSC_3597.jpg

OR like my 15 year old former spare tire.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v417/vttedrm/DSC_4949.jpg